AA IRC discussion

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Cielli
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AA IRC discussion

Post by Cielli »

Regarding this https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/inde ... on.213095/

Let's get a list started.

off the top of my head... I'd like to see a revival of the Servant of Ro line into some useful amount of DPS.

And who wouldn't like an upgrade to Virulent Talon?

Companions blessing's heal amounts are outdated, could use a revival.

Aegis of Kildrukaun AA... the cast time could be lower ( or non-existant )

An AA that enhances our Rain spells... ? something for dps...

Post your ideas/thoughts.
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Sancus
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Sancus »

OK, so some things I'd like to see updated:
  • Spell Casting Fury: This is generally a staple upgrade for caster DPS, so I'm surprised it wasn't updated...
  • Destructive Fury: Same as above
  • Elemental Forms: Air needs stun cap updated, Earth probably needs an increase in damage cap, and Water could do with a bump in MR
  • Host of the Elements: After watching them evaporate on raids today, I think they need an upgrade
  • Servant of Ro: Would like it to be worthwhile again
There are some AAs that need increases as damage/HP/mana increases in the next xpac: Second Wind Ward, Mana Reserve, Host in the Shell, and Fortify Companion.

As for new AAs:
  • Mod rods: The AA mod rods are so much better than spell ones, and they haven't seen an upgrade since HoT
  • Defensive AAs: Since Eldiroth probably won't upgrade our pet defensive AAs because they're for DS mitigation or something, I'd like to see a real pet defensive AA, preferably with % mitigation
  • Crit Chance AAs: Right now, the only crit modifier we have is First Spire, which is a 21% increase for 90 seconds. A number of other DPS classes are able to get up to a 100% crit rate, or close for a short period of time. It wouldn't help much in a raid setting (since we're at or near 100% anyway), but it would give us a bump in groups where we don't have ADPS support
  • Pet AAs:I've always thought our pet procs were rather bland, and could be expanded on. Maloseniac Eminence came with CotF which went down this path. I'm not necessarily looking for pet DPS procs (they don't report for parses :? ), but I'm sure we could get some interesting procs for our pets. Long term procs would most likely be better as spells, but we could also get some short term procs as AAs. An example could be a weaponshield (4s of WS or something) or healing proc. It could even lock out VT, to give us a choice between tanking and DPS.
  • Swarm Pets: As mages we're supposed to be the master of elements and pets. Our main pets and RS pets continue to be strong, but our other pets have fallen into mostly uselessness. Making Servant of Ro and Host useful again (beyond for salvo) would be awesome, and any other swarm pets would be cool.
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Fleiss
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Fleiss »

Upgrade Theft of Essence
Twinproc AAs
Multi-Aura AA
Thaumatize pet spell into AA

Weary about anything that is a pet proc. We already have too many conflicts in this area, upgrade existing is fine.

I wouldn't mind kildru being instant but thinking they would have to recode since you can't haste something lower than 50% cast time.

Continue to bump up or crit rates/ITC/and burn AAs.

I seriously doubt we can get but new line of pet defensive AAs. Fortify companion is a rune (which the damage that it can absorb has hardly been touched since it was created) and with recent change to how much dps a pet change really made it weak. It either needs a major revamp in how much damage it can absorb or create a new line for mage/bst/nec for pet tanking. Love to just see a flat % mitigation disc on a timer, or a fort/WS like AA. All of our tools mages can use have been trashed. We have runes that are hit based (pets getting hit more times now) or have weak overall absorption caps (compare fortify to NTTB). I would almost rather they make a new line and ditch fortify upgrades. Once they gave the AA to more than mage/bst/nec it has been on a hard decline. It is great to allow shm/enc/sk to now have their pets up during raids without a random AE or mob eating them instantly, but far from a tanking AA anymore.

I will probably remember a couple other things as well later.
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Voragath
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Voragath »

Cielli wrote:Regarding this https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/inde ... on.213095/

Let's get a list started.

off the top of my head... I'd like to see a revival of the Servant of Ro line into some useful amount of DPS.

And who wouldn't like an upgrade to Virulent Talon?

Companions blessing's heal amounts are outdated, could use a revival.

Aegis of Kildrukaun AA... the cast time could be lower ( or non-existant )

An AA that enhances our Rain spells... ? something for dps...

Post your ideas/thoughts.
Nice list. Just wanted to note, the Kildrukaun AA is a direct copy of the spell so they can't hasten it more than 50%--in other words, it can't be made instant. I'd push to have the whole thing redone. Especially with how much a joke pet defensives are atm.
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Voragath
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Voragath »

Sancus wrote: As for new AAs:
  • Mod rods: The AA mod rods are so much better than spell ones, and they haven't seen an upgrade since HoT
They really don't ever want to touch or upgrade this ever again. Energy would be better spent in getting the spell upgraded. Putting energy from the aa to upgrading the spell line resulted in us getting a self-only spell version of the mod rod. Had we not looked at the spell line for the upgrade, we wouldn't have ever gotten it.

Not that I disagree with updating it. I always pushed for an upgrade for a self-only mod rod aa as a companion to the spell version.

We should push for some serious pet dps upgrade abilities now. Leverage the fact that we now "pay maintenance" to keep our pets up so we should be allowed to have far better dps boosts now. They have zero arguments to call pets "free dps" so now that they aren't free, we can reap the benefit. Push hard.
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Enkel
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Enkel »

Voragath wrote:
Sancus wrote: As for new AAs:
  • Mod rods: The AA mod rods are so much better than spell ones, and they haven't seen an upgrade since HoT
They really don't ever want to touch or upgrade this ever again. Energy would be better spent in getting the spell upgraded. Putting energy from the aa to upgrading the spell line resulted in us getting a self-only spell version of the mod rod. Had we not looked at the spell line for the upgrade, we wouldn't have ever gotten it.

Not that I disagree with updating it. I always pushed for an upgrade for a self-only mod rod aa as a companion to the spell version.

We should push for some serious pet dps upgrade abilities now. Leverage the fact that we now "pay maintenance" to keep our pets up so we should be allowed to have far better dps boosts now. They have zero arguments to call pets "free dps" so now that they aren't free, we can reap the benefit. Push hard.
Be careful with how much % of our total damage you put into pets compared to spells, considering pets are still broken from a dps perspective (still suffering like they did during VoA). Their damage, still, is much lower than it was during VoA, and nothing, save the 8-20 update, changed that. They still have spikes on raids were they will stop attacking for a period of time and lock up; too much stock into pets could put us behind the curve because of unresolved issues like the above (among other things that remain broken).
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Cielli
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Cielli »

I'm wracking my brain for another idea to increase pet dps. to be honest I'd like an increase in Base Pet DPS... not as much an AA, of course I'd take an AA, too. Frenzied Burnout & Virulent Talon are good AAs, I'd hate to ask for something else only to find those AAs did not receive upgrades.

I'd also like a 5th Pet... but that. is also not an AA.

Off the top of my head, without making something which is too similar to the existing Pet offensive AA's. Maybe A limited strike proc ( like VT ) that procs Raging servants... maybe 10 or 12 of them ( that would be like 30kdps for a 1 minuteish period, not much more than VT ). Would be complicated using them in raids, as you're not going to be able to switch targets, but like all things, we could learn to control it.

Would also function as an 'Oh smurf' button, for getting an unexpected add, as the servants would function as offtanks, rather than pulling aggro directly to our pet.

I have no idea how easy or hard that would be to code.
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Eanelder
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Eanelder »

As a utility, id like to see an 'Improved Call Hither' AA that is instant cast, and that will block summoning for 1 tick and/or dispell any movement impairing effects. My Reasoning is our pets *should* be able to off tank, but if any PC or Merc is standing in range this cant happen. We can use Call Hither now, to summon the PC/Merc out of the way but with the 3sec(?) cast time, its been my experience they don't often survive. Other possible scenarios include pullers getting snared, or badly hit before reaching camp, hence the dispel/summon immunity. Also useful for just saving mercs in general as it seems they don't know how to get out of the way and would rather cast to try to survive then move.

I believe we were one of the first classes to get the "fling" type AAs, and other classes AA that received something similar have been instant (granted they pull mobs), so I think its time for an upgrade.

Id also like to see an AA that compliments Gift of Mana, 'Gift of Synergy'. Basically if Gift of Mana procs it refreshes a spell gem from a specified spell series. I think this would be ideal as an Archetype AA and a Mage procing GoM would have their Servant spell gem refreshed. So in the case where Servant is actually the spell that triggers GoM, you could immediately recast it. The Gift of Mana however should only refresh the gem of the of the spell series from the same level, so a level 80 GoM wont refresh a lvl 100 Servant gem, only the Lvl 80 gem.

As a fluff AA, I'd like to see pet Illusion AAs called Elemental Aspect of _______. There could eventually be several of these aa, with the blank identifying the type of illusion and each pet would be effected differently by the AA ( 1 AA for each set of 4 different illusions). For example my first choice would be Elemental Aspect of Kuaa which would make Fire look like Pyrilen, Water like Gelidran, air look like lightning warriors, and earth like golems, all from the Omens of War expansion. Or Elemental Aspect of the Ancients which would make our pets look like the original blobs with arms models, or at the very least tirun models with different elemental skins. Next obvious one would be Elemental Aspect of Katta, which would make the pets look like the Buried Sea expansion elementals. Perhaps adding some additional effect, proc, or DS could be added, but really id just like to see the illusion.
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Voragath
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Voragath »

Enkel wrote:
Be careful with how much % of our total damage you put into pets compared to spells, considering pets are still broken from a dps perspective (still suffering like they did during VoA). Their damage, still, is much lower than it was during VoA, and nothing, save the 8-20 update, changed that. They still have spikes on raids were they will stop attacking for a period of time and lock up; too much stock into pets could put us behind the curve because of unresolved issues like the above (among other things that remain broken).
If pets are still locking up at raids, then that should be reported as a bug and an issue. The original reason they were locking up was a result of processing power. Basically, pets were last on the process list so if the server fell behind, pets didn't attack as their process got skipped. They did an upgrade to server, did some changes to process loads, and changed some code which all resolved the pet issue.

It is possible we are seeing some sort of process issue again.
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Enkel
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Re: AA IRC discussion

Post by Enkel »

Pets still lock up for several seconds at a time on certain, high add, raids. Their burn, on those raids, will go down to around 11k (with full buffs), from their normal 26-30k (note that it was higher dps during RoF, but there was a mob level increase. Pets still do the same dps in RoF that they used to do (pre patch 8-20), save fire pet, but when put in CoTF content they do less). It has been bugged, and brought up, and zero response has been given.
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