Calling for pet nerfs

Anything relating to the magical arts (pets, spells, AAs).
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deadman1204
Arch Mage
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:51 pm

Re: Calling for pet nerfs

Fri May 02, 2014 3:43 pm

Unfortunately that argument cannot work.
It requires for mages to education the community, instead of saying
"mages are bad. Hate them"

One requires thought, the other a mindless emotional plea. And we've all seen that requiring thought from the tank community is a lost cause recently
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Felinya
Magician
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Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2012 4:51 pm

Re: Calling for pet nerfs

Fri May 02, 2014 5:06 pm

Honestly I don't see it as a call for a nerf but more of a plead for some help by wars. Knights are looking for some help on mitigation also. I didn't read the thread but most of my friends are tanks because I was one for nearly a decade. The war class is in disarray and more are leaving it than people are creating a new one. When you have a class that is the state where they are now, they get upset quick. The class has been stripped of its uniqueness and given to knights as most classes have done to their cousin classes.

As a war grouping with friends we would grind exp for hours and do difficult camps where the mobs hit like trucks. Our cleric would have no issue keeping me up because I would use all of my tools/discs as soon as they were available. I never slacked unless I was botting. One day I played my nec with them solely (mage, mage, bard, cleric, nec (me), sham) and the exp was flying in faster. The cleric was nuking rather than keeping me alive while tossing promises and HoT's on pet. As a tank, I was pretty dejected but as a necro I loved it. Drop your tank for another range dps? sweet! THis is how they are feeling. I'm certain it's not personal but they want to enjoy the game and feel like they aren't a drain or a liability.

Can tanks tank...sure. Can pets tank...hhmm ya.
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deadman1204
Arch Mage
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Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:51 pm

Re: Calling for pet nerfs

Mon May 05, 2014 9:31 am

Except there is nothing actually wrong with Warriors. I'd argue that they are the most carefully balanced class by sony. All combat is based off of what they can and cannot do.

Tanks have an enormous amount of energy devoted to this false narrative that they cannot succeed, and that pets are better.

50% of all classes in the game cannot join a pet group. HALF THE CHARACTERS IN THE GAME!! No one can enter melee with a pet tank.

But that non-tank group cannot do alot of difficult content. Many named have adds or mechanics that cannot be managed by a pet. Heck, a single add is hard for a pet. They have ZERO ae agro. In the real game, tanks far exceed what a pet can do, because crap happens. You get adds, repawns, trains, bad pulls, ect. Pets can only sit and watch their master die when that happens.

The true difference is that warriors take more attention to detail than a pet. They have many abilities to activate. Pets do not have as many, because their owners have 100000 other abilities too.

Many people say their tanks are inferior, because they are botting other characters as well. But surprise, no botted character will be as good as one who is getting 100% attention. Tanks just happen to show they are not being played as well more than others.
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Sillaen
Arch Convoker
Posts: 522
Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 12:34 pm

Re: Calling for pet nerfs

Tue May 06, 2014 3:57 pm

The whole root of the problem with a few of these clueless warriors is that they truly believe that mitigation = tanking, end of story. Until they learn this is not the case and get over their shortsightedness, this nonsense will continue.

But then again, if someone else had made some useless afk parses and found a different single statistic that a pet does better than them, it would be the same story.

This is nothing but the class envy phenomenon of -- I must avoid, mitigate, dps, heal, slow, haste, kick, punch, slap, eat, drink, sleep, blah blah blah and do it the better than anyone else.
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Bedavir
Banned
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Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:57 pm

Re: Calling for pet nerfs

Wed May 07, 2014 6:21 am

Have you ever stopped to ponder whether it might be that you as a non-tank archetype are underestimating the value of rote baseline mitigation and the resultant steady and predictable incoming damage?

The tanking community figured this out almost a decade ago as well as prominent members of the healer community (Crystilla comes to mind). This is not a new concept to us. It is, and has been for a decade now, the holy grail of tanking.

To put it in terms you can maybe better understand ... I would give up last stand, NTTB, and every other activatable minor defensive discipline in my arsenal to mitigate like current pets do - and the result would be a more survivable me at baseline. I would be giving up my brief moments of invincibility - but that'd still be a trade off if be willing to make.

When spikes are a veritable mathematical impossibility, you are not a hard target to heal.
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dreneth
Newbie
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu May 01, 2014 4:48 pm

Re: Calling for pet nerfs

Thu May 08, 2014 11:46 am

Felinya wrote:Honestly I don't see it as a call for a nerf but more of a plead for some help by wars. Knights are looking for some help on mitigation also. I didn't read the thread but most of my friends are tanks because I was one for nearly a decade. The war class is in disarray and more are leaving it than people are creating a new one. When you have a class that is the state where they are now, they get upset quick. The class has been stripped of its uniqueness and given to knights as most classes have done to their cousin classes.

As a war grouping with friends we would grind exp for hours and do difficult camps where the mobs hit like trucks. Our cleric would have no issue keeping me up because I would use all of my tools/discs as soon as they were available. I never slacked unless I was botting. One day I played my nec with them solely (mage, mage, bard, cleric, nec (me), sham) and the exp was flying in faster. The cleric was nuking rather than keeping me alive while tossing promises and HoT's on pet. As a tank, I was pretty dejected but as a necro I loved it. Drop your tank for another range dps? sweet! THis is how they are feeling. I'm certain it's not personal but they want to enjoy the game and feel like they aren't a drain or a liability.

Can tanks tank...sure. Can pets tank...hhmm ya.
I'd like to thank you for sharing your understanding, perspective and insights. I can identify with a lot of your post.

I don't know what the answer is. Nerfs that affect pet survivability would be bad. Buffing tanks to appropriate relative-to-pet levels would break the game. I'm still hopeful that the pet community can offer up better suggestions than 'These aren't the nerfs you're looking for, move along'
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Voragath
Grand Summoner
Posts: 1165
Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 9:32 pm

Re: Calling for pet nerfs

Fri May 09, 2014 10:16 am

I am locking this one down. Due to it's nature and the result of the other similar thread, it seems the discussion has run it's course.

I generally do not like locking topics but the other thread got way out of hand, even for this site.
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