In the Raid game we need to relook at how we are veiwing ourselves. Yeah we are DPS, just not high on the food chain, but we have other jobs. Mage air pets are what most the guilds I have ever been in want, cause hey, who else stuns like an air pet. If you are a raid mage who doesn't have clerics sending tells for mod rods, your mages are not doing thier jobs. Then the DS's and procs that help the tank build hate, yes only small amounts but every bit helps when events eat tanks and they need to rebuild agro while the raid DPS has been on the list for a while. The role of a mage is much more than just DPS, and it is selfish of a mage to think otherwise.
Funny stuff, are you really a mage? You certainly dont raid thats clear.
Go troll somewhere else.
I know I'm in here late, but this made me Lol. Wow .... seriously, just wow.
Mages are a dps class, nothing more. We are not a cross, a hy-brid, a utility, tank or anything else. We compete for the dps role with the other dps'ers and that's it. We fall behind as we have before and soon there will only be 1 spot in a raid for a boxed mage, again.
Raid mages do not use air pets on raids.
Rods are casted before encounters, not during. No one should ever be asking me for a rod during a fight, unless that fight goes over 30 mins.
Dmg shields are a joke.
Tanks don't need any help building hate.
Actually Air pets are very useful on some UF raids atm. As it stands for the top 5 guilds in EQ or so mages will only be wanted to MGB rods before every event. Like I said the top 5, if your guild isn't up near the top then really I don't see mages not making parses. The reason why is because guilds at the top will have necros, rogues, wizzies, zerkers who are all good at playing their class and even the best mage can not top the best of pretty much any pure DPS class right now in a burn situation. Guilds not in the top tier will not see as many of the pure DPS classes, or not the superstars the top tier guilds have.
As Sillaen said tho, most of our 'utility' is a joke nowadays. We are a PURE DPS class now, whether we like it or not.
"All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others."—Douglas Adams
Mindrix wrote:And the reason there isn't much "consensus" is that Magician consensus was, for many years, what Kozvar & I decided. Others had a say in the matter, but we set the rules for how things were going to get done. That ship has now sailed, so the boat is completely at the whim of the Developers. No Magician has the force of standing with the community to really impose their will, so it will simply move around to what is popular. Just hope what is popular is good for the Magician class.
I have always appreciated YOUR work mindrix, but please dont group kozvar in with you, he will drag you down. He was a useless arse with terrible ideas and a massive ego.
I remember quite a few beta's where you posted like a demon and he barely showed an interest.
Piemastaj wrote:Actually Air pets are very useful on some UF raids atm. As it stands for the top 5 guilds in EQ or so mages will only be wanted to MGB rods before every event. Like I said the top 5, if your guild isn't up near the top then really I don't see mages not making parses. The reason why is because guilds at the top will have necros, rogues, wizzies, zerkers who are all good at playing their class and even the best mage can not top the best of pretty much any pure DPS class right now in a burn situation. Guilds not in the top tier will not see as many of the pure DPS classes, or not the superstars the top tier guilds have.
As Sillaen said tho, most of our 'utility' is a joke nowadays. We are a PURE DPS class now, whether we like it or not.
Well, I'll go one better Pie, and I agree with you. I'm just upping the ante here. Guilds like mine who are mid to top end mid-tier guilds, will be right where the end gamers are now in 6 months. In 6 months, my dps won't show up on the list as we begin getting and farming the final UF tier. By the end of HoT, about 10 to 11 months from now, almost any raiding guild in UF will be there. It won't be as exaggerated as the top ender's are seeing, but it will be noticeably bad and have the same effect that end gamers are seeing now.
idk really. I see your point with getting weapons and what not as you move up in tiers, but like I said the mid-tier guilds lack the hardcore people in each class. And with the more hardcore people you have the harder it is for classes that are lacking in DPS to catch-up with those classes who aren't lacking. I mean don't get me wrong weapons and focuses help out a ton, but your still giving those to the same people your guild had before. So in all honesty no matter where your guild is I doubt the mid-tiers see much fluctuation in terms of magicians losing raid spots. Like Falore, he has a HUGE chance of losing a raid spot just because his guild is all about DPS and it has people who know their classes in and out.
That is just how I see it though. Even with our terrible out-look in raid DPS I really have 0 fear of losing my raid spot. I'm normally in the top 5 every night on the DPS charts. My guild isn't in the top 5, and yes it lacks hardcore people in certain classes which is why I can make the parses every night
"All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others."—Douglas Adams
Same here but where I was normally always top 5, once UF came out, I started dropping. I'm always top ten, uncommonly top 5, and rarely in the top 2. It's getting worse and worse as we progress through. Even when we merged a Tunare guild with us, I didn't drop too much so my skill level, at least it seems to me based on this, is solid for playing a mage. I still have the same hope that I'm wrong and that the prediction you made is right, just to me it looks like even with the lower skill, we may be seeing Falore's dilemma even still.
Ok, Lenamder found out the new jolting blades proc does 2 things: 2k in dmg and hate reduction (alla isn't picking up the hate change, listed at 0, but the message that the proc went of is)
IF this is not a bug, it's not too bad as our new raid weapon for pets. It'll keep pets down low on hate while still boosting dps by about 150. Sash and Len figured the dps out today.
Baby steps, I guess. But this would be a nice change and a step in the right direction if it's intended. At the very least, it'll be like this until the first patch or hotfix. So tomorrow, at your raids, you'll wanna throw these bad boys onto your water pet
Mindrix wrote:And the reason there isn't much "consensus" is that Magician consensus was, for many years, what Kozvar & I decided. Others had a say in the matter, but we set the rules for how things were going to get done. That ship has now sailed, so the boat is completely at the whim of the Developers. No Magician has the force of standing with the community to really impose their will, so it will simply move around to what is popular. Just hope what is popular is good for the Magician class.
I have always appreciated YOUR work mindrix, but please dont group kozvar in with you, he will drag you down. He was a useless arse with terrible ideas and a massive ego.
I remember quite a few beta's where you posted like a demon and he barely showed an interest.
So glad he got us CON 2
Koz took the brunt of the criticism, but people still have never gotten that when a Dev decides "how" something will be done, we don't really get a say in the structure from there. It's just arguing values. Kozvar had his preferences, but he was always, ALWAYS the best CL/CC at bringing up what was important to the community and what people asked for. He spent a lot of time trying to get things done that he didn't really care about. Like the incoming "Grant" summons. He was never on that hobby horse, but he pushed for it for years. People never really got how important and valuable to the class he was.
If everyone else got a 20% boost and you got a 10% boost, how is that not a nerf?
My "I told you so" was directed at those who are now acting shocked that our pets didn't get the upgrades we have come to expect. Given the offset of the boosts to other classes, let alone mob boosts, how can you consider it anything other than one puny step above not getting any upgrade?
As to why I didn't participate in the beta, ask Sony why they didn't accept my application. I did my part. Not being able to get into the beta, at the first wind of our pets being nerfed through poor scaling, I came here and expressed concern, and urged those in the beta to voice up in unison against it, and I was basically shouted down for trolling.
